Discussion:
Stargate Movie(1994): reactionary template or bad flic?
(too old to reply)
boris badenov
2008-06-25 20:37:43 UTC
Permalink
also sprach supermann...

Welcome to the existential nightmare that is known to most as
STARGATE. Stargate was a PG-13 sci-fi epic that was released in the
summer of 1994 to lack-luster reviews, but some popular acclaim. The
many critics that panned this film concentrated on what they believed
were plotholes and sub-standard creative abilities on the part of the
script. Stargate, they belived, was a badly written story, and with
their strict time restraints in viewing new releases, the critics
were
forced(?) to move on to the next lemon without giving Stargate a more
careful look. The general audience did more or less the same. That
had
turned out to be an earth-shattering mistake.
The official synopsis is as follows: A discredited Egyptologist,
Daniel Jackson (played by James Spader), decyphers the function of an
ancient mechanical portal, long buried in the sands of Giza. Upon
which, the air force dispatches a team of "military specialists" to
utilize the portal to transport themselves halfway across the
universe
to a desert planet inhabited by north africans, "enslaved" to labor
in
quartz mines by an astounding being identified as the Egyptian god,
Ra. In the coarse of events, the specialists do battle with the sun
god, "liberate" the down-trodden inhabitants from forced servitude,
and rescue the earth from total inihilation at the hands of Ra.
An erroneous social and political context was applied by the
audience when they had viewed this film and certain salient details
about the characters, their behavior, and their motivations have all
been left unsaid...or even unnoticed. The erroneous context applied
was simply that this is just a "movie". Stargate is not just a
science
fiction film. I would be more accurrate if I were to refer to it as a
parable about a particular event....our present situation in Iraq,
how
we came to be involved there, and the moral, ethical, and psychiatric
disposition of the people who got us there.
The movie STARGATE never made any sense as a science fiction tale,
but as a primer of ideological aggression of the reactionary
persuasion, it is nothing less than an emotional template of what may
be going on in the heads of the Bush Crime Cartel and their
immeadiate
adherents in the right wing. Certain details may not match up, but,
as
we all have seen, the results are generally the same.
It is with this that I find Stargate so facinating. There were many
films that tout, explicitly or implicitly, sociopathic erges and
bias,
but I believe that STARGATE is the first film that is so totally
self-
aware and accepting of its anti-humanist leanings, that for reasons
only known to themselves, the producers allowed, in the script,
subtle
hints and clues that the sun god RA is actually little more than the
victim of Colonel O'Niel's military aggression, and it is the Colonel
himself who is more worthy of being designated the "villian". These
so-
called clues are definite and unshakable, once they are percieved.
Unfortunately, "perception", as in the case of watching this film,
is a matter of political outlook. Far too many people watched this
film and could not see below its glossy, symbolistic superficiality.
Noone was watching too closely, or listening too carefully.
The "facts" are as follows:


Colonel Jack O'Niel, a deranged and suicidal individual, was given
charge of an atomic weapon, presummedly under circumstances that
would
preclude a sane and well-adjusted man.


O'Niel secretly transport the weapon, unbeknownst to his
subordinates in his recon team. The Japanese would refer to this
policy as "kamakaze". A recon team without a nuke would be considered
"expendable". A recon team WITH a nuke would be considered already
"expended".


You know, if a squad of american soldiers were to travel billions
of
light-years through a stargate, only to arrive on a planet inhabited
by harmless, pre-industrial north africans, you would think that
relations with these people would go with little trouble....instead
of:


In the very first instant upon meeting the africans, O'Niel drew
his
weapon and brandished under the nose of a frightened teen-ager. The
boy screamed and fled. Noone else in O'Niel's team saw it fit to draw
their own weapons.


Later, and with the very same boy, O'Niel again found it neccessary
to menace the boy again with an automatic weapon. The child, merely
curious, had attempted to pick up the weapon to examine it. He
screamed and fled again after O'Niel's second assault.


And later still, when O'Niel and his men were, in every respect,
"legally" apprehended by Ra's guards and brought to the throne room
to
answer for, among other things, the presence of an atomic bomb among
their personal effects, O'Niel's only response was to physically
attack everyone in the throne room. All this, within close proximity
of a dozen young children, mostly pre-teen. And at the climax of this
scuffle, O'Niel trained his weapon at these same children, struggling
with the idea of killing them in order to get at a seated and unarmed
Ra. At the instant that O'Niel was struck down from behind, it was
clear enough that he was losing his "struggle" and was about to pull
the trigger.
With a movie audience that's an expert at drawing moral conclusions
based on a quick sketch of moral character in action, how could so
many have accepted what has taken place in that room to the point
that
they ignored all the subsequent war crimes accumilated by O'Niel by
the end of the movie? They were numerous:
Needless to say, according to continuity, those same schoolchildren
were still in the pyramid when it was destroyed by O'Niel and
Jackson.
Prior to that, O'Niel led a battillion of heavily armed teenagers
on
a frontal assault against Ra's pyramid fortress( All individuals
deemed "teenagers", are, in my estimation, well below 18 years in
age.). A situation made worse as they took on heavy casualties. If
the
boys had decided to do this on their own, it's a tragedy of it's own
making, but they were, apparently, illegally conscripted by O'Niel
for
combat they weren't trained to win, in a situation instigated solely
by O'Niel.
during the same firefight, according to editing, it appeared as
though Jackson accidentally shot one of his own boys...he squeezed
off
a couple of shots backwards over his shoulder without aiming, looking
in another direction.


Prior to that, O'Niel captured one of Ra's guards, an individual
barely out of his teens, himself. This person, who surrendered
without resistence, was executed with his own weapon by O'Niel,
solely
to prove to the north africans that the guard was a mortal, like
themselves.


Prior to that, while hiding in a cave, O'Niel had made the partial
admission that his case was less than defensible, but now "that Ra
has
the bomb", something must be done. Considering that "the bomb" was
actually the weapon that O'Niel secretly brought with him from earth
in the first place, that kind of circular logic to justify an action
movie maybe a disturbing indicator.


And prior to that, During the one verbal confrontation with Ra, The
sun god essentially made a rational ultimatum of exchanging the life
of O'Niel for the lives of "all who knew" Jackson...implicating the
planet earth. By this time, O'Niel was so criminally culpable, that
the choice was perfectly easy to make. Needless to say Jackson didn't
make that choice. To be fair, the dialogue did not make that point
explicitly clear, but that was the underlining jist of what Ra meant.
And although one may resent being dictated terms to by an enemy in a
position of power, You must remember, Ra didn't CHOOSE to be the
enemy. It is the most disturbing moral aspect of this movie.
However, on the other hand, the conversation could also be
interpreted as your run-of-the-mill "Ming the Merciless" tirade,
threatening the earth and it's inhabitants if Jackson didn't comply
with his demands.
The grammer and syntax of the verbal exchange was so precisely
ambiguous, that it was possible for even the most discerning observer
to derive two different meanings from Ra's statements. The verbal
acrobatics of this dialogue seems to indicate to me that the
producers
were well aware of the moral and ethical ambiguity, but sought to
lean
the movie audience toward the reactionary side by using certain
stereotypical cues and signs, like menacing mood music and indicative
posturing, to "demonize" Ra's character before the audience. For
example, when I first saw Stargate, I thought Ra was the "heavy",
solely because of the way he walks about the throneroom; sexually
suggestive, stalking like a cat almost, with a soundtrack that's just
as feline as he is. I knew that no good could come from such a
person.....and he hasn't even spoken his first lines yet. Somehow,
"content of character", the exact criteria in judging "good" from
"evil", was completely absent from these procedings.
When one produces a "good vs evil" action film, but shows a certain
disinterest in the core meaning of what "good" and "evil" stands for,
then it stands to reason that this character flaw will somehow
translate itself into the screenplay....as it did here.
But we needn't fuck around with such hub-bubbery as this. The film,
STARGATE, is obviously politically driven. Do I have a problem with
it? I sure do, but it's not the main thing. The main thing is that so
few people percieved the true motivations of this greek tragedy, that
if anything like this were to take place in real life, at the expense
of american taxdollars, would there be enough people to garner
political support to put a stop to it?


Tragically, in our particularly sad case, the answer is no.
boris badenov
2008-06-25 20:47:23 UTC
Permalink
[snip]
(Ignoring the advice not to respond to you)
C'mon! The system lords are an evil, corrupt regime. They are cruel to
their enemies and keep their subjects under their collective boot.
Killing Ra was the best thing that could happen to the people of
Abodos. The O'Neil character in the movie was following orders. Go see
if their is a threat, use the nuke if you find one. A better order
might have been: if you find a threat, come back and we'll rebury the
gate. Of course, that would not have made for an exciting climax to the
movie. Instead of using the rings to send the bomb to Ra's ship, O'Neil
and Co. come back and assign a bunch of privates the job of digging a hole.
Well, guess what? The world changed on 9/11, and now America, who Bin
Laden thought was a paper tiger, is out there kicking terrorist butt.
We blasted the Taliban and blew Saddam into oblivion. Next up: N.
Korea, Syria, Iran, Libya. Fortunately, as of Nov 2000, there were 500
more people who think like me than people who think like you, at least
in Florida. I figure that since 9/11, that number has grown
considerably. So you can expect GWB to be kicking ass around the world
until 2008.
*whoa!*

When was the last time all the nuts fell at once?


(supermann takes a half-step back to thoughtfully peruse Mr.
Meazell)


So, you are an arch-conservative, eh? Welcome to Michigan. The
atmosphere here is a mix of nitrogen and oxygen...with trace gases.
When I say "mix", I meant "mixture"; an intermingling, like most of
our college campuses, and other public accomodations. Don't be afraid
of the nitrogen, or anything else begining with "N". More than
anything, it's just here to cut the amount of oxygen you've been
getting.


I'll be honest w/ you, Ger, in the very begining I saw some merit
to
what Dubya appeared to be doing with iraq: bluffing down Saddam to
get
him to disarm. We were actually getting results and the UN and Hans
Blix was going along with it. Fine, but as it turn out, we
completely
misread Bush. The president is a colonialist psychopath living out of
the early twentieth century. He stabbed europe in the ass to get at
the oil, inviting Tony Blair along for a piece of the action in
exchange for british credibility. If Bush gave two shits for the
plight of the iraqi people while so many americans go wanting, it's
news to me.


As for Stargate, and its parallels to our situation, a lot is
already under the bridge, but dig, it isn't over yet. Stargate is
only
an infomercial, selling a product, nothing more...even though it went
against everything I was raised to believe about this
country...nothing is finalized yet.
Did you know that Dubya's grandfather was a nazi collaberator?
No, he was a wealthy businessman who had investments in Germany before ...
No, he was a nazi collaborator.

your court,


supermann
boris badenov
2008-06-25 20:54:39 UTC
Permalink
Eva View profile
More options Jun 20, 3:25 am

Newsgroups: alt.tv.stargate-sg1
From: "Eva" <***@ukonline.co.uk>
Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 08:25:13 +0100
Local: Fri, Jun 20 2008 3:25 am
Subject: Re: O'Neill's conduct on Stargate, the movie
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OK, this guy's fucked up on something...will somebody tell me what the
hell he's talking about? What does he mean by "ascended"?
Might I recommend you actually WATCH the show?
You might begin to have a CLUE then.
I don't think he's made it past the movie. Just as well; imagine all
the
questionable deeds he would find in the show! :-))

Eva
--
Join the Stargate SG-1 ***@home Team
http://setiweb.ssl.berkeley.edu/team_display.php?teamid=30516


"Ceremonies have killed religions for they provide the masked comforts
to
delusionals..."




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Andrew Halliwell View profile
More options Jun 20, 4:17 am

Newsgroups: alt.tv.stargate-sg1, alt.tv.stargate-atlantis
From: Andrew Halliwell <***@ponder.sky.com>
Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 09:17:36 +0100
Local: Fri, Jun 20 2008 4:17 am
Subject: Re: O'Neill's conduct on Stargate, the movie
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I'd be offended if I found him walking around my home WITH congressional
oversight, but that's irrelevant. Congress has absolutely no power over
me
thankyouverymuch.
that is incorrect. the people endowed congress with the consent to
represent.
No we didn't.

--
| ***@freenet.co,uk | "Are you pondering what I'm pondering
Pinky?" |
| Andrew Halliwell BSc
| |
| in | "I think so brain, but this time, you
control |
| Computer Science | the Encounter suit, and I'll do the
voice..." |




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himiko View profile
On Jun 19, 7:07 pm, "Doug Brown" <***@sasktel.net> wrote: >
What other use do tactical nukes have other than military purposes?
They make lovely ashtrays. himiko
More options Jun 20, 10:18 am

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From: himiko <***@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 07:18:30 -0700 (PDT)
Local: Fri, Jun 20 2008 10:18 am
Subject: Re: O'Neill's conduct on Stargate, the movie
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What other use do tactical nukes have other than military purposes?
They make lovely ashtrays.

himiko




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supermann View profile
More options Jun 20, 5:19 pm

Newsgroups: alt.tv.stargate-sg1, alt.tv.stargate-atlantis
From: supermann <***@yahoo.com>
Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 14:19:13 -0700 (PDT)
Local: Fri, Jun 20 2008 5:19 pm
Subject: Re: O'Neill's conduct on Stargate, the movie
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I ask you. Should your goverment remove a nuke from the stockpile for
strictly military purposes and not tell you?
What other use do tactical nukes have other than military purposes?
Diplomacy, of the "Cuban Missile" type. Maybe I should rephrase
this....

What O'Niel did on Abbydos, *you*, as a taxpayer, weren't supposed
to know.... would you like to have been told?


OK, I'm getting a little beyond myself, here. This is the basic
thing: I have fantasies like the next guy, right? Sometimes I, as do
the rest of us, allow filmakers to manufacture surrogate "fantasies"
for me, in the form of films. For the most part, the makers of these
films or stories, are regular people just like you and me....and tend
to have a simular moral/ ethical bearing when they are designing
their
characters for casting.
All the heroes I have ever seen in movies tend to be like me in
the
sense that their concept of good and evil is close enough to my own
that I tend to extend a "pass" on those "good guys", even when they
stretch the rules a bit...(how far they can stretch those rules
usually depends on how bad the "bad guy" is.)
Now where I come from, what constitute a "bad guy" is an individual
who pre-emptively does bad things to people and/ or is defined as
"bad" by the sum results of deeds committed against the innocent.
That
is to say, if the "hero" was to take action against an individual,
using violence, the observing audience- (this is theater-) has to be
reassured that the targeted individual has demonstrated that not only
he is the "bad guy", but that the particulate "good guy" has every
right to kung fu kick the shit out of him on the behalf of the
observing audience -(this is now the jury box; "good and evil" is
being judiciated.)
As I said a minute ago, we all supposed to share a common moral
standard...when we sit down and watch a film...or work behind the
camera to make one.
To be honest, I don't know where I came up with that crap....the
honest truth....people are as morally and ethically diverse as the
diversity of fishes in a hotel lobby aquarium. There are good people,
doing good things...and there are individuals, totally laquered in
evil. Good people find strength and fellowship in like-minded
company....evil folks, much to my chagrin, do the same.


To keep this short...I did not enjoy Stargate. This film, unlike
others, weren't tailored to my particular moral bearing, nor to the
best of my reckoning, to even that of anyone I even know. I could not
identify myself with the actor designated as "hero"...he didn't even
act like a hero...he looked and acted like a cheap fascist cutthroat.
Totally beyond the scope of the law. I do not have fantasies where I
envision commiting human rights abuses against non-combatant children
in order to exercise my passions toward "heroic acts" against an
enemy
who fought defensively against O'Niel's incursion into his territory
of residence.


How is this possible? I'm Black. An african-american, you see. I am
also a part-time school bus driver in an african- american
neighborhood. That means that, 99 cents to a dollar, I have more in
common, culturally and racially, with the kids that O'Niel had either
a weapon pointed at, or illegally issued a weapon to, than I could
ever muster for O'Niel himself. I cart those exact same tykes back
and
forth to school each day. It would not even occur to me that there
are
human beings in this world who would do the the things to them for
material or political gain that Kurt Russell simulated doing to them
for simple entertainment.


I am the descendant of africans whose continent was over-run by
Col. Jack O'Niells, by the boatloads, over the pass three
centuries....so what I saw in Stargate came as little ontological
surprise to me. Sometimes an animal can't help but reveal itself.


I fight evil where I find it. I found enough here to outline and
define an illegal war....*any* illegal war.


So I ask you again, "What did O'Niel do on Abbydos that you
consider "legal"?
John
2008-06-25 21:12:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by boris badenov
I am the descendant of africans whose continent was over-run by
Col. Jack O'Niells, by the boatloads, over the pass three
centuries....so what I saw in Stargate came as little ontological
surprise to me. Sometimes an animal can't help but reveal itself.
What part of Africa? Would it be a part where powerful community (tribe)
members sold citizens to the white traders? Or is that a white myth?
Post by boris badenov
So I ask you again, "What did O'Niel do on Abbydos that you
consider "legal"?
Nothing whatsoever. He interfered with another civilization. He presumed
his culture was superior. He screwed up. I'd like to have seen the movie
end with all the gaters dead and dried up on the desert, blown away in a
slow motion panorama of the planet as it blossomed into greater success.
-Phil Clemence
2008-07-30 22:34:45 UTC
Permalink
"John" <***@droffats.ten> wrote in message news:***@supernews.com...
| boris badenov wrote:
| >
| > I am the descendant of africans whose continent was over-run by
| > Col. Jack O'Niells, by the boatloads, over the pass three
| > centuries....so what I saw in Stargate came as little ontological
| > surprise to me. Sometimes an animal can't help but reveal itself.
|
| What part of Africa? Would it be a part where powerful community (tribe)
| members sold citizens to the white traders? Or is that a white myth?
|
| > So I ask you again, "What did O'Niel do on Abbydos that you
| > consider "legal"?
|
| Nothing whatsoever. He interfered with another civilization. He presumed
| his culture was superior. He screwed up. I'd like to have seen the movie
| end with all the gaters dead and dried up on the desert, blown away in a
| slow motion panorama of the planet as it blossomed into greater success.
|

You hate yourself so much.
Modern civilisation is the best civilization ever known.
Don't get romantic about the past.
Everything leading up til now was shit.
Never seen an alien civilization. Have you?
Probably eat every living thing on earth including us.
Pfffft
Citizen Jimserac
2008-06-25 22:07:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by boris badenov
also sprach supermann...
Welcome to the existential nightmare that is known to most as
STARGATE. Stargate was a PG-13 sci-fi epic that was released in the
summer of 1994 to lack-luster reviews, but some popular acclaim. The
many critics that panned this film concentrated on what they believed
were plotholes and sub-standard creative abilities on the part of the
script. Stargate, they belived, was a badly written story, and with
their strict time restraints in viewing new releases, the critics
were
forced(?) to move on to the next lemon without giving Stargate a more
careful look. The general audience did more or less the same. That
had
turned out to be an earth-shattering mistake.
The official synopsis is as follows: A discredited Egyptologist,
Daniel Jackson (played by James Spader), decyphers the function of an
ancient mechanical portal, long buried in the sands of Giza. Upon
which, the air force dispatches a team of "military specialists" to
utilize the portal to transport themselves halfway across the
universe
to a desert planet inhabited by north africans, "enslaved" to labor
in
quartz mines by an astounding being identified as the Egyptian god,
Ra. In the coarse of events, the specialists do battle with the sun
god, "liberate" the down-trodden inhabitants from forced servitude,
and rescue the earth from total inihilation at the hands of Ra.
An erroneous social and political context was applied by the
audience when they had viewed this film and certain salient details
about the characters, their behavior, and their motivations have all
been left unsaid...or even unnoticed. The erroneous context applied
was simply that this is just a "movie". Stargate is not just a
science
fiction film. I would be more accurrate if I were to refer to it as a
parable about a particular event....our present situation in Iraq,
how
we came to be involved there, and the moral, ethical, and psychiatric
disposition of the people who got us there.
The movie STARGATE never made any sense as a science fiction tale,
but as a primer of ideological aggression of the reactionary
persuasion, it is nothing less than an emotional template of what may
be going on in the heads of the Bush Crime Cartel and their
immeadiate
adherents in the right wing. Certain details may not match up, but,
as
we all have seen, the results are generally the same.
It is with this that I find Stargate so facinating. There were many
films that tout, explicitly or implicitly, sociopathic erges and
bias,
but I believe that STARGATE is the first film that is so totally
self-
aware and accepting of its anti-humanist leanings, that for reasons
only known to themselves, the producers allowed, in the script,
subtle
hints and clues that the sun god RA is actually little more than the
victim of Colonel O'Niel's military aggression, and it is the Colonel
himself who is more worthy of being designated the "villian". These
so-
called clues are definite and unshakable, once they are percieved.
Unfortunately, "perception", as in the case of watching this film,
is a matter of political outlook. Far too many people watched this
film and could not see below its glossy, symbolistic superficiality.
Noone was watching too closely, or listening too carefully.
Colonel Jack O'Niel, a deranged and suicidal individual, was given
charge of an atomic weapon, presummedly under circumstances that
would
preclude a sane and well-adjusted man.
O'Niel secretly transport the weapon, unbeknownst to his
subordinates in his recon team. The Japanese would refer to this
policy as "kamakaze". A recon team without a nuke would be considered
"expendable". A recon team WITH a nuke would be considered already
"expended".
You know, if a squad of american soldiers were to travel billions
of
light-years through a stargate, only to arrive on a planet inhabited
by harmless, pre-industrial north africans, you would think that
relations with these people would go with little trouble....instead
In the very first instant upon meeting the africans, O'Niel drew
his
weapon and brandished under the nose of a frightened teen-ager. The
boy screamed and fled. Noone else in O'Niel's team saw it fit to draw
their own weapons.
Later, and with the very same boy, O'Niel again found it neccessary
to menace the boy again with an automatic weapon. The child, merely
curious, had attempted to pick up the weapon to examine it. He
screamed and fled again after O'Niel's second assault.
And later still, when O'Niel and his men were, in every respect,
"legally" apprehended by Ra's guards and brought to the throne room
to
answer for, among other things, the presence of an atomic bomb among
their personal effects, O'Niel's only response was to physically
attack everyone in the throne room. All this, within close proximity
of a dozen young children, mostly pre-teen. And at the climax of this
scuffle, O'Niel trained his weapon at these same children, struggling
with the idea of killing them in order to get at a seated and unarmed
Ra. At the instant that O'Niel was struck down from behind, it was
clear enough that he was losing his "struggle" and was about to pull
the trigger.
With a movie audience that's an expert at drawing moral conclusions
based on a quick sketch of moral character in action, how could so
many have accepted what has taken place in that room to the point
that
they ignored all the subsequent war crimes accumilated by O'Niel by
Needless to say, according to continuity, those same schoolchildren
were still in the pyramid when it was destroyed by O'Niel and
Jackson.
Prior to that, O'Niel led a battillion of heavily armed teenagers
on
a frontal assault against Ra's pyramid fortress( All individuals
deemed "teenagers", are, in my estimation, well below 18 years in
age.). A situation made worse as they took on heavy casualties. If
the
boys had decided to do this on their own, it's a tragedy of it's own
making, but they were, apparently, illegally conscripted by O'Niel
for
combat they weren't trained to win, in a situation instigated solely
by O'Niel.
during the same firefight, according to editing, it appeared as
though Jackson accidentally shot one of his own boys...he squeezed
off
a couple of shots backwards over his shoulder without aiming, looking
in another direction.
Prior to that, O'Niel captured one of Ra's guards, an individual
barely out of his teens, himself. This person, who surrendered
without resistence, was executed with his own weapon by O'Niel,
solely
to prove to the north africans that the guard was a mortal, like
themselves.
Prior to that, while hiding in a cave, O'Niel had made the partial
admission that his case was less than defensible, but now "that Ra
has
the bomb", something must be done. Considering that "the bomb" was
actually the weapon that O'Niel secretly brought with him from earth
in the first place, that kind of circular logic to justify an action
movie maybe a disturbing indicator.
And prior to that, During the one verbal confrontation with Ra, The
sun god essentially made a rational ultimatum of exchanging the life
of O'Niel for the lives of "all who knew" Jackson...implicating the
planet earth. By this time, O'Niel was so criminally culpable, that
the choice was perfectly easy to make. Needless to say Jackson didn't
make that choice. To be fair, the dialogue did not make that point
explicitly clear, but that was the underlining jist of what Ra meant.
And although one may resent being dictated terms to by an enemy in a
position of power, You must remember, Ra didn't CHOOSE to be the
enemy. It is the most disturbing moral aspect of this movie.
However, on the other hand, the conversation could also be
interpreted as your run-of-the-mill "Ming the Merciless" tirade,
threatening the earth and it's inhabitants if Jackson didn't comply
with his demands.
The grammer and syntax of the verbal exchange was so precisely
ambiguous, that it was possible for even the most discerning observer
to derive two different meanings from Ra's statements. The verbal
acrobatics of this dialogue seems to indicate to me that the
producers
were well aware of the moral and ethical ambiguity, but sought to
lean
the movie audience toward the reactionary side by using certain
stereotypical cues and signs, like menacing mood music and indicative
posturing, to "demonize" Ra's character before the audience. For
example, when I first saw Stargate, I thought Ra was the "heavy",
solely because of the way he walks about the throneroom; sexually
suggestive, stalking like a cat almost, with a soundtrack that's just
as feline as he is. I knew that no good could come from such a
person.....and he hasn't even spoken his first lines yet. Somehow,
"content of character", the exact criteria in judging "good" from
"evil", was completely absent from these procedings.
When one produces a "good vs evil" action film, but shows a certain
disinterest in the core meaning of what "good" and "evil" stands for,
then it stands to reason that this character flaw will somehow
translate itself into the screenplay....as it did here.
But we needn't fuck around with such hub-bubbery as this. The film,
STARGATE, is obviously politically driven. Do I have a problem with
it? I sure do, but it's not the main thing. The main thing is that so
few people percieved the true motivations of this greek tragedy, that
if anything like this were to take place in real life, at the expense
of american taxdollars, would there be enough people to garner
political support to put a stop to it?
Tragically, in our particularly sad case, the answer is no.
Thank you for quite an interesting AND intriguing perspective
on Stargate, one of my favorite movies.
I shall most certainly view it again in the light
of the implications and interpretations which
you have suggested, there DOES seem to be
an element of definite applicability of your
interpretation connecting current events with the movie.

One often wonders if the screenwriters and producers
INTEND to make the implications or ambiguities
that appear in films and in many cases I believe
that they do.

Aon Flux, for example, was SPOILED by an overemphasis
on the theme of technology out of control
by the evil scientists while ignoring the possibility
that it was the underlying politics IN CONTROL
of the scientsts that should have been emphasized.
My critical review of this failed film at Amazon
mentions this point and suggests to the producers
that the next time they wished to make a movie
with such themes, they would have done well to
make it based on a book, now largely forgotten,
"The City and The Stars" by Arthur Clarke.

V for Vendetta, on the other hand, was
stunning and brilliant in its adherence to
the conflict between the totalitarian state
and the obstinacy of a movement inspired by
a man whose desire for revenge transcended the
easy lies and patriotic platitudes of the
state.

More recently, the controversial "Golden Compass"
move again succeeded in staying true
to its ideals while concealing underneath the
surface an entire SPECTRUM of the most unexpectedly
profound metaphysical, socio-political and philosophical
implications VERY relevant to us and our future.
It was NOT, as other have tried so very hard
(jumping up and down and pouting and whining)
just another fantasy genre movie.

Citizen Jimserac
boris badenov
2008-06-26 20:02:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Citizen Jimserac
also sprachsupermann...
 Welcome to the existential nightmare that is known to most as
STARGATE.Stargatewas a PG-13 sci-fi epic that was released in the
summer of 1994 to lack-luster reviews, but some popular acclaim. The
many critics that panned this film concentrated on what they believed
were plotholes and sub-standard creative abilities on the part of the
script.Stargate, they belived, was a badly written story, and with
their strict time restraints in viewing new releases, the critics
were
forced(?) to move on to the next lemon without givingStargatea more
careful look. The general audience did more or less the same. That
had
turned out to be an earth-shattering mistake.
  The official synopsis is as follows: A discredited Egyptologist,
Daniel Jackson (played by James Spader), decyphers the function of an
ancient mechanical portal, long buried in the sands of Giza. Upon
which, the air force dispatches a team of "military specialists" to
utilize the portal to transport themselves halfway across the
universe
to a desert planet inhabited by north africans, "enslaved" to labor
in
quartz mines by an astounding being identified as the Egyptian god,
Ra. In the coarse of events, the specialists do battle with the sun
god, "liberate" the down-trodden inhabitants from forced servitude,
and rescue the earth from total inihilation at the hands of Ra.
  An erroneous social and political context was applied by the
audience when they had viewed this film and certain salient details
about the characters, their behavior, and their motivations have all
been left unsaid...or even unnoticed. The erroneous context applied
was simply that this is just a "movie".Stargateis not just a
science
fiction film. I would be more accurrate if I were to refer to it as a
parable about a particular event....our present situation in Iraq,
how
we came to be involved there, and the moral, ethical, and psychiatric
disposition of the people who got us there.
  The movieSTARGATEnever made any sense as a science fiction tale,
but as a primer of ideological aggression of the reactionary
persuasion, it is nothing less than an emotional template of what may
be going on in the heads of the Bush Crime Cartel and their
immeadiate
adherents in the right wing. Certain details may not match up, but,
as
we all have seen, the results are generally the same.
  It is with this that I findStargateso facinating. There were many
films that tout, explicitly or implicitly, sociopathic erges and
bias,
but I believe thatSTARGATEis the first film that is so totally
self-
aware and accepting of its anti-humanist leanings, that for reasons
only known to themselves, the producers allowed, in the script,
subtle
hints and clues that the sun god RA is actually little more than the
victim of Colonel O'Niel's military aggression, and it is the Colonel
himself who is more worthy of being designated the "villian". These
so-
called clues are definite and unshakable, once they are percieved.
  Unfortunately, "perception", as in the case of watching this film,
is a matter of political outlook. Far too many people watched this
film and could not see below its glossy, symbolistic superficiality.
Noone was watching too closely, or listening too carefully.
  Colonel Jack O'Niel, a deranged and suicidal individual, was given
charge of an atomic weapon, presummedly under circumstances that
would
preclude a sane and well-adjusted man.
  O'Niel secretly transport the weapon, unbeknownst to his
subordinates in his recon team. The Japanese would refer to this
policy as "kamakaze". A recon team without a nuke would be considered
"expendable". A recon team WITH a nuke would be considered already
"expended".
  You know, if a squad of american soldiers were to travel billions
of
light-years through astargate, only to arrive on a planet inhabited
by harmless, pre-industrial north africans, you would think that
relations with these people would go with little trouble....instead
  In the very first instant upon meeting the africans, O'Niel drew
his
weapon and brandished under the nose of a frightened teen-ager. The
boy screamed and fled. Noone else in O'Niel's team saw it fit to draw
their own weapons.
  Later, and with the very same boy, O'Niel again found it neccessary
to menace the boy again with an automatic weapon. The child, merely
curious, had attempted to pick up the weapon to examine it. He
screamed and fled again after O'Niel's second assault.
  And later still, when O'Niel and his men were, in every respect,
"legally" apprehended by Ra's guards and brought to the throne room
to
answer for, among other things, the presence of an atomic bomb among
their personal effects, O'Niel's only response was to physically
attack everyone in the throne room. All this, within close proximity
of a dozen young children, mostly pre-teen. And at the climax of this
scuffle, O'Niel trained his weapon at these same children, struggling
with the idea of killing them in order to get at a seated and unarmed
Ra. At the instant that O'Niel was struck down from behind, it was
clear enough that he was losing his "struggle" and was about to pull
the trigger.
  With a movie audience that's an expert at drawing moral conclusions
based on a quick sketch of moral character in action, how could so
many have accepted what has taken place in that room to the point
that
they ignored all the subsequent war crimes accumilated by O'Niel by
  Needless to say, according to continuity, those same schoolchildren
were still in the pyramid when it was destroyed by O'Niel and
Jackson.
  Prior to that, O'Niel led a battillion of heavily armed teenagers
on
a frontal assault against Ra's pyramid fortress( All individuals
deemed "teenagers", are, in my estimation, well below 18 years in
age.). A situation made worse as they took on heavy casualties. If
the
boys had decided to do this on their own, it's a tragedy of it's own
making, but they were, apparently, illegally conscripted by O'Niel
for
combat they weren't trained to win, in a situation instigated solely
by O'Niel.
  during the same firefight, according to editing, it appeared as
though Jackson accidentally shot one of his own boys...he squeezed
off
a couple of shots backwards over his shoulder without aiming, looking
in another direction.
  Prior to that, O'Niel captured one of Ra's guards, an individual
barely out of his teens, himself. This person, who surrendered
without resistence, was executed with his own weapon by O'Niel,
solely
to prove to the north africans that the guard was a mortal, like
themselves.
  Prior to that, while hiding in a cave, O'Niel had made the partial
admission that his case was less than defensible, but now "that Ra
has
the bomb", something must be done. Considering that "the bomb" was
actually the weapon that O'Niel secretly brought with him from earth
in the first place, that kind of circular logic to justify an action
movie maybe a disturbing indicator.
  And prior to that, During the one verbal confrontation with Ra, The
sun god essentially made a rational ultimatum of exchanging the life
of O'Niel for the lives of "all who knew" Jackson...implicating the
planet earth. By this time, O'Niel was so criminally culpable, that
the choice was perfectly easy to make. Needless to say Jackson didn't
make that choice. To be fair, the dialogue did not make that point
explicitly clear, but that was the underlining jist of what Ra meant.
And although one may resent being dictated terms to by an enemy in a
position of power, You must remember, Ra didn't CHOOSE to be the
enemy. It is the most disturbing moral aspect of this movie.
  However, on the other hand, the conversation could also be
interpreted as your run-of-the-mill "Ming the Merciless" tirade,
threatening the earth and it's inhabitants if Jackson didn't comply
with his demands.
  The grammer and syntax of the verbal exchange was so precisely
ambiguous, that it was possible for even the most discerning observer
to derive two different meanings from Ra's statements. The verbal
acrobatics of this dialogue seems to indicate to me that the
producers
were well aware of the moral and ethical ambiguity, but sought to
lean
the movie audience toward the reactionary side by using certain
stereotypical cues and signs, like menacing mood music and indicative
posturing, to "demonize" Ra's character before the audience. For
example, when I first sawStargate, I thought Ra was the "heavy",
solely because of the way he walks about the throneroom; sexually
suggestive, stalking like a cat almost, with a soundtrack that's just
as feline as he is. I knew that no good could come from such a
person.....and he hasn't even spoken his first lines yet. Somehow,
"content of character", the exact criteria in judging "good" from
"evil", was completely absent from these procedings.
  When one produces a "good vs evil" action film, but shows a certain
disinterest in the core meaning of what "good" and "evil" stands for,
then it stands to reason that this character flaw will somehow
translate itself into the screenplay....as it did here.
  But we needn't fuck around with such hub-bubbery as this. The film,
STARGATE, is obviously politically driven. Do I have a problem with
it? I sure do, but it's not the main thing. The main thing is that so
few people percieved the true motivations of this greek tragedy, that
if anything like this were to take place in real life, at the expense
of american taxdollars, would there be enough people to garner
political support to put a stop to it?
  Tragically, in our particularly sad case, the answer is no.
Thank you for quite an interesting AND intriguing perspective
onStargate, one of my favorite movies.
I shall most certainly view it again in the light
of the implications and interpretations which
you have suggested, there DOES seem to be
an element of definite applicability of your
interpretation connecting current events with the movie.
One often wonders if the screenwriters and producers
INTEND to make the implications or ambiguities
that appear in films and in many cases I believe
that they do.
Aon Flux, for example, was SPOILED by an overemphasis
on the theme of technology out of control
by the evil scientists while ignoring the possibility
that it was the underlying politics IN CONTROL
of the scientsts that should have been emphasized.
My critical review of this failed film at Amazon
mentions this point and suggests to the producers
that the next time they wished to make a movie
with such themes, they would have done well to
make it based on a book, now largely forgotten,
"The City and The Stars" by Arthur Clarke.
V for Vendetta, on the other hand, was
stunning and brilliant in its adherence to
the conflict between the totalitarian state
and the obstinacy of a movement inspired by
a man whose desire for revenge transcended the
easy lies and patriotic platitudes of the
state.
More recently, the controversial "Golden Compass"
move again succeeded in staying true
to its ideals while concealing underneath the
surface an entire SPECTRUM of the most unexpectedly
profound metaphysical, socio-political and philosophical
implications VERY relevant to us and our future.
It was NOT, as other have tried so very hard
(jumping up and down and pouting and whining)
just another fantasy genre movie.
Citizen Jimserac
You, sir, are a gentleman. I have been at my wits end about the
greater implications of being able to produce a film as socially
destructive as this and not have its underlying sentiments rise to the
level of cognacy in the audience. My biggest problem is whom I had
chose to argue this point with. Those mindless snots over at
"alt.tv.stargate-sg1" have a lot more wrong with them than just their
spelling abilities. Indeed, it was their over-reliance on their
"apologetics" that tipped me off that they're something other than
simple fans of the tv show.
You may find some of their arguements entertaining. I am all but
done with them...


supermann
Andrew Halliwell
2008-06-26 20:17:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by boris badenov
You, sir, are a gentleman. I have been at my wits end about the
greater implications of being able to produce a film as socially
destructive as this and not have its underlying sentiments rise to the
level of cognacy in the audience. My biggest problem is whom I had
chose to argue this point with. Those mindless snots over at
"alt.tv.stargate-sg1"
Exqueeze me?
And you are?
Don't recall you're ever having posted here before anyway.


have a lot more wrong with them than just their
Post by boris badenov
spelling abilities. Indeed, it was their over-reliance on their
"apologetics" that tipped me off that they're something other than
simple fans of the tv show.
You may find some of their arguements entertaining. I am all but
done with them...
Well fuck off then. No-one asked you to post this shit here, so why did you?
Just to cause a bit of an argument?
Little bit of trolling from someone who's never posted here before and
decides to crosspost to half of usenet in the process?

[follow-ups set]
Post by boris badenov
supermann
--
| ***@freenet.co.uk | Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
| Andrew Halliwell BSc | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
| in |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
| Computer Science | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
monte
2008-07-12 02:11:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by boris badenov
Post by Citizen Jimserac
also sprachsupermann...
Welcome to the existential nightmare that is known to most as
STARGATE.Stargate was a PG-13 sci-fi epic that was released in the
summer of 1994 to lack-luster reviews, but some popular acclaim. The
many critics that panned this film concentrated on what they believed
were plotholes and sub-standard creative abilities on the part of the
script. Stargate , they belived, was a badly written story, and with
their strict time restraints in viewing new releases, the critics
were
forced(?) to move on to the next lemon without giving Stargate a more
careful look. The general audience did more or less the same. That
had
turned out to be an earth-shattering mistake.
The official synopsis is as follows: A discredited Egyptologist,
Daniel Jackson (played by James Spader), decyphers the function of an
ancient mechanical portal, long buried in the sands of Giza. Upon
which, the air force dispatches a team of "military specialists" to
utilize the portal to transport themselves halfway across the
universe
to a desert planet inhabited by north africans, "enslaved" to labor
in
quartz mines by an astounding being identified as the Egyptian god,
Ra. In the coarse of events, the specialists do battle with the sun
god, "liberate" the down-trodden inhabitants from forced servitude,
and rescue the earth from total inihilation at the hands of Ra.
An erroneous social and political context was applied by the
audience when they had viewed this film and certain salient details
about the characters, their behavior, and their motivations have all
been left unsaid...or even unnoticed. The erroneous context applied
was simply that this is just a "movie".Stargate is not just a
science
fiction film. I would be more accurrate if I were to refer to it as a
parable about a particular event....our present situation in Iraq,
how
we came to be involved there, and the moral, ethical, and psychiatric
disposition of the people who got us there.
The movie STARGATE never made any sense as a science fiction tale,
but as a primer of ideological aggression of the reactionary
persuasion, it is nothing less than an emotional template of what may
be going on in the heads of the Bush Crime Cartel and their
immeadiate
adherents in the right wing. Certain details may not match up, but,
as
we all have seen, the results are generally the same.
It is with this that I findStargateso facinating. There were many
films that tout, explicitly or implicitly, sociopathic erges and
bias,
but I believe tha t STARGATE is the first film that is so totally
self-
aware and accepting of its anti-humanist leanings, that for reasons
only known to themselves, the producers allowed, in the script,
subtle
hints and clues that the sun god RA is actually little more than the
victim of Colonel O'Niel's military aggression, and it is the Colonel
himself who is more worthy of being designated the "villian". These
so-
called clues are definite and unshakable, once they are percieved.
Unfortunately, "perception", as in the case of watching this film,
is a matter of political outlook. Far too many people watched this
film and could not see below its glossy, symbolistic superficiality.
Noone was watching too closely, or listening too carefully.
Colonel Jack O'Niel, a deranged and suicidal individual, was given
charge of an atomic weapon, presummedly under circumstances that
would
preclude a sane and well-adjusted man.
O'Niel secretly transport the weapon, unbeknownst to his
subordinates in his recon team. The Japanese would refer to this
policy as "kamakaze". A recon team without a nuke would be considered
"expendable". A recon team WITH a nuke would be considered already
"expended".
You know, if a squad of american soldiers were to travel billions
of
light-years through a stargate, only to arrive on a planet inhabited
by harmless, pre-industrial north africans, you would think that
relations with these people would go with little trouble....instead
In the very first instant upon meeting the africans, O'Niel drew
his
weapon and brandished under the nose of a frightened teen-ager. The
boy screamed and fled. Noone else in O'Niel's team saw it fit to draw
their own weapons.
Later, and with the very same boy, O'Niel again found it neccessary
to menace the boy again with an automatic weapon. The child, merely
curious, had attempted to pick up the weapon to examine it. He
screamed and fled again after O'Niel's second assault.
And later still, when O'Niel and his men were, in every respect,
"legally" apprehended by Ra's guards and brought to the throne room
to
answer for, among other things, the presence of an atomic bomb among
their personal effects, O'Niel's only response was to physically
attack everyone in the throne room. All this, within close proximity
of a dozen young children, mostly pre-teen. And at the climax of this
scuffle, O'Niel trained his weapon at these same children, struggling
with the idea of killing them in order to get at a seated and unarmed
Ra. At the instant that O'Niel was struck down from behind, it was
clear enough that he was losing his "struggle" and was about to pull
the trigger.
With a movie audience that's an expert at drawing moral conclusions
based on a quick sketch of moral character in action, how could so
many have accepted what has taken place in that room to the point
that
they ignored all the subsequent war crimes accumilated by O'Niel by
Needless to say, according to continuity, those same schoolchildren
were still in the pyramid when it was destroyed by O'Niel and
Jackson.
Prior to that, O'Niel led a battillion of heavily armed teenagers
on
a frontal assault against Ra's pyramid fortress( All individuals
deemed "teenagers", are, in my estimation, well below 18 years in
age.). A situation made worse as they took on heavy casualties. If
the
boys had decided to do this on their own, it's a tragedy of it's own
making, but they were, apparently, illegally conscripted by O'Niel
for
combat they weren't trained to win, in a situation instigated solely
by O'Niel.
during the same firefight, according to editing, it appeared as
though Jackson accidentally shot one of his own boys...he squeezed
off
a couple of shots backwards over his shoulder without aiming, looking
in another direction.
Prior to that, O'Niel captured one of Ra's guards, an individual
barely out of his teens, himself. This person, who surrendered
without resistence, was executed with his own weapon by O'Niel,
solely
to prove to the north africans that the guard was a mortal, like
themselves.
Prior to that, while hiding in a cave, O'Niel had made the partial
admission that his case was less than defensible, but now "that Ra
has
the bomb", something must be done. Considering that "the bomb" was
actually the weapon that O'Niel secretly brought with him from earth
in the first place, that kind of circular logic to justify an action
movie maybe a disturbing indicator.
And prior to that, During the one verbal confrontation with Ra, The
sun god essentially made a rational ultimatum of exchanging the life
of O'Niel for the lives of "all who knew" Jackson...implicating the
planet earth. By this time, O'Niel was so criminally culpable, that
the choice was perfectly easy to make. Needless to say Jackson didn't
make that choice. To be fair, the dialogue did not make that point
explicitly clear, but that was the underlining jist of what Ra meant.
And although one may resent being dictated terms to by an enemy in a
position of power, You must remember, Ra didn't CHOOSE to be the
enemy. It is the most disturbing moral aspect of this movie.
However, on the other hand, the conversation could also be
interpreted as your run-of-the-mill "Ming the Merciless" tirade,
threatening the earth and it's inhabitants if Jackson didn't comply
with his demands.
The grammer and syntax of the verbal exchange was so precisely
ambiguous, that it was possible for even the most discerning observer
to derive two different meanings from Ra's statements. The verbal
acrobatics of this dialogue seems to indicate to me that the
producers
were well aware of the moral and ethical ambiguity, but sought to
lean
the movie audience toward the reactionary side by using certain
stereotypical cues and signs, like menacing mood music and indicative
posturing, to "demonize" Ra's character before the audience. For
example, when I first sawStargate, I thought Ra was the "heavy",
solely because of the way he walks about the throneroom; sexually
suggestive, stalking like a cat almost, with a soundtrack that's just
as feline as he is. I knew that no good could come from such a
person.....and he hasn't even spoken his first lines yet. Somehow,
"content of character", the exact criteria in judging "good" from
"evil", was completely absent from these procedings.
When one produces a "good vs evil" action film, but shows a certain
disinterest in the core meaning of what "good" and "evil" stands for,
then it stands to reason that this character flaw will somehow
translate itself into the screenplay....as it did here.
But we needn't fuck around with such hub-bubbery as this. The film,
STARGATE, is obviously politically driven. Do I have a problem with
it? I sure do, but it's not the main thing. The main thing is that so
few people percieved the true motivations of this greek tragedy, that
if anything like this were to take place in real life, at the expense
of american taxdollars, would there be enough people to garner
political support to put a stop to it?
Tragically, in our particularly sad case, the answer is no.
Thank you for quite an interesting AND intriguing perspective
onStargate, one of my favorite movies.
I shall most certainly view it again in the light
of the implications and interpretations which
you have suggested, there DOES seem to be
an element of definite applicability of your
interpretation connecting current events with the movie.
One often wonders if the screenwriters and producers
INTEND to make the implications or ambiguities
that appear in films and in many cases I believe
that they do.
Aon Flux, for example, was SPOILED by an overemphasis
on the theme of technology out of control
by the evil scientists while ignoring the possibility
that it was the underlying politics IN CONTROL
of the scientsts that should have been emphasized.
My critical review of this failed film at Amazon
mentions this point and suggests to the producers
that the next time they wished to make a movie
with such themes, they would have done well to
make it based on a book, now largely forgotten,
"The City and The Stars" by Arthur Clarke.
V for Vendetta, on the other hand, was
stunning and brilliant in its adherence to
the conflict between the totalitarian state
and the obstinacy of a movement inspired by
a man whose desire for revenge transcended the
easy lies and patriotic platitudes of the
state.
More recently, the controversial "Golden Compass"
move again succeeded in staying true
to its ideals while concealing underneath the
surface an entire SPECTRUM of the most unexpectedly
profound metaphysical, socio-political and philosophical
implications VERY relevant to us and our future.
It was NOT, as other have tried so very hard
(jumping up and down and pouting and whining)
just another fantasy genre movie.
Citizen Jimserac
You, sir, are a gentleman. I have been at my wits end about the
greater implications of being able to produce a film as socially
destructive as this and not have its underlying sentiments rise to the
level of cognacy in the audience. My biggest problem is whom I had
chose to argue this point with. Those mindless snots over at
"alt.tv.stargate-sg1" have a lot more wrong with them than just their
spelling abilities. Indeed, it was their over-reliance on their
"apologetics" that tipped me off that they're something other than
simple fans of the tv show.
You may find some of their arguements entertaining. I am all but
done with them...
supermann
'Ey Super-bro



I couldn't help butt notice how all your STARGATE words were pushed up
together w/ other words so that they...meaning the article....wouldn't
come up in a google search....so I give you a hand, and seperated them
for you. I did it because I hate fascists so fooking much!!! I dig
your article bro- You stay on them...


monte of monroe
-Phil Clemence
2008-07-30 22:40:44 UTC
Permalink
| > > just another fantasy genre movie.
| >
| > > Citizen Jimserac
| >
| > You, sir, are a gentleman. I have been at my wits end about the
| > greater implications of being able to produce a film as socially
| > destructive as this and not have its underlying sentiments rise to the
| > level of cognacy in the audience. My biggest problem is whom I had
| > chose to argue this point with. Those mindless snots over at
| > "alt.tv.stargate-sg1" have a lot more wrong with them than just their
| > spelling abilities. Indeed, it was their over-reliance on their
| > "apologetics" that tipped me off that they're something other than
| > simple fans of the tv show.
| > You may find some of their arguements entertaining. I am all but
| > done with them...
| >
| > supermann
|
| 'Ey Super-bro
|
|
|
| I couldn't help butt notice how all your STARGATE words were pushed up
| together w/ other words so that they...meaning the article....wouldn't
| come up in a google search....so I give you a hand, and seperated them
| for you. I did it because I hate fascists so fooking much!!! I dig
| your article bro- You stay on them...
|
|
| monte of monroe



You mean you are so jealous of fascists, don't you?
I mean, that if you could, you would take charge and straighten things
out...because, of course YOU know what's best.
Or was there some other reason prompting those bad feelings that you must
direct outward in blame?
You stay on them, too...
Your meds, I mean.
Phil Clemence

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